Cursed Quests are now Duality Quests
I've also reset all quests to celebrate this change! :)
Note: If something isn't working correctly based off Mori and Nori's quests, like shop search doesn't show their quest shop items properly or something, please let me know. Quests get mentioned in a lot of places and while I think I updated everything everywhere, I could be wrong!
Posted by 
Amber
Pandaslowpoke
This is prety neat but, 2 things
The Description for the Starlight Spirit from their quest shop has a typo/weird phrasing.
And secondly, i'm kinda sad how this means that Maleria now no longer technically has a daughter, likethey didn't get to interact in any plot but i feel a tad sad about that plotpoint now being gone for good, specially since it could have been used to show a more sympathetic side of Maleria.
The Description for the Starlight Spirit from their quest shop has a typo/weird phrasing.
And secondly, i'm kinda sad how this means that Maleria now no longer technically has a daughter, likethey didn't get to interact in any plot but i feel a tad sad about that plotpoint now being gone for good, specially since it could have been used to show a more sympathetic side of Maleria.
2
KiaArra
I am only a *little* sad these changes didn't come in the form of a plot. Ever since joining subeta, way before we even had actual lore about Mori and Nori, I have harbored hope that there would be some sort of plot around breaking their curse. Removing the curse association, and the name of the quests/achievements is all well and good; but the new adventures of Mono finding relics across subeta and piecing together a statue to create Mori and Nori would have made for a great plot! And I'm sad to see this opportunity missed. :(
3
Rarface
I deeply regret procrastinating on doing quests. At least I get to double dip on the blue building quests? 😭
0
fun
@lago if i'm understanding correctly, it is (and has been) a more divine type of multiple souls inhabiting one vessel rather than straight DID. because of her backstory being overtly negative it lead to a lot of DID-offensive-adjacent terms being used around the site. i don't think anyone believes mori/nori is a representation of DID, just that it is very adjacent, enough so that the way their backstory was handled was harmful to some. the forum discusses this pretty in-depth if you're interested in seeing others' viewpoints on this as well
11
Iago
uhh I have DID and being like 'oh this girl being cursed isnt PC anymore, now she has DID' seems like....the opposite of progressive ;/
7
Ferinsy
I understand why the achievements were changed, but the word "cursed" being removed is kinda... okay, but why? They can still have 2 personalities and be the target of a curse, it's not like the fantasy of Subeta (talking bears, magic, even the pets) is present in the real world. Still, it doesn't really affect me in any way, so it's not like I'm against it.
14
demon
to doffuse some of the tension here.... wheres my creative royalties amber 😤😤😤 anyway thanks for the change
4
villain
@Amber i do appreciate y'all have changed so much. but to many users they wanted the one main thing changed (achievement name) and then the rest could come later. after 1.5 years it just began to feel....well, it began to feel silly. all very in the dark & not listened to.
thank you for taking the time today to listen and discuss in the comments. thank you for trying to own up to any mistakes & be accountable. i know you're just another human behind the screen, and i appreciate the efforts you guys on staff are making. i am glad these changes have happened! i appreciate anything to make subeta more inclusive, especially for something so close to me personally. i was just saying i can understand why so many are frustrated still.
thank you for taking the time today to listen and discuss in the comments. thank you for trying to own up to any mistakes & be accountable. i know you're just another human behind the screen, and i appreciate the efforts you guys on staff are making. i am glad these changes have happened! i appreciate anything to make subeta more inclusive, especially for something so close to me personally. i was just saying i can understand why so many are frustrated still.
12
Amber
For those reading comments that seem to be missing context: I deleted quite a few comments regarding misinformation about Dissociative identity disorder (DID). I thought it was originally good to keep the conversation (though putting a stop to it) so people could see the original problem and the correction by a user who is much more knowledgeable about it then me. That wasn't the best way to handle things, as some people might not read all the comments and would miss the corrections.
There will be an edit to the news post soon from a user who has stood up for self and can explain why the change to the quest and overall lore was important. It shouldn't be on the shoulders of someone with a disorder to constantly explain why something is harmful, but I'm glad this user stepped up.
I am keeping up my original posts and the posts from other users pointing out just how badly this was handled so maybe someone can learn from my mistakes!
There will be an edit to the news post soon from a user who has stood up for self and can explain why the change to the quest and overall lore was important. It shouldn't be on the shoulders of someone with a disorder to constantly explain why something is harmful, but I'm glad this user stepped up.
I am keeping up my original posts and the posts from other users pointing out just how badly this was handled so maybe someone can learn from my mistakes!
20
brokensafety
There is controversy among even medical professionals regarding the diagnosis and presentation of D.I.D. that I think it would be fair to cut staff some slack. Staff has listened to user feedback and are trying to be more sensitive to user concerns.
28
feral
That's very PR, and still entirely misses the the mark.
I disagree and I would prefer not to be pinged again unless I'm receiving authoritative action. thanks.
I disagree and I would prefer not to be pinged again unless I'm receiving authoritative action. thanks.
2
LilyValentine
Cool, can we get rid of the racist items next, or..? Or the description of an item that calls someone a "sissy" if they're a male person who wears it?
No, just this? K.
No, just this? K.
7
Amber
@villain @feral There were a lot of very icky descriptions elsewhere on the site and in the subetapedia that the users on that thread pointed out (which I'm grateful for). It wasn't just that achievement title that, as pointed out, gross. We needed to change everything, not just one or two things. I'm sure I still missed a description somewhere and will gladly change it if someone points it out to me! While we on staff never forgot about it and did debate how to handle the change in lore back and fourth, we should've prioritized it more and I'm sorry about that. I really am thankful for the users on that thread that gave suggestions on how to rework things to be less harmful.
3
fun
feral is right and you're overlooking their message in favor of saying you did a big change when over 2 years and multiple pages people have explained the most harmful language that we wanted changed immediately and you did not address the rest of their comment at all, staff has been hiding behind the "big change" shield for literal years and no apology for something painfully drawn out. said it in the forum but you have been addressing one point specifivally instead of the other 10 people have brought up. I'm at work so I'll respond to your question in a bit but the short answer is delete posts that are harmful...?
5
Amber
@fun I am in no way comfortable with editing the news post to describe the actual reason why the quests as cursed with good/evil was harmful for DID only because my knowledge on it is limited. Would you be willing to write a few sentences describing DID and why it was harmful the way quests were set up before? I'd be up for quoting that in the news post so people see that and then delete the conversation earlier with you and Truffula. It will also prevent you from having to keep explaining things (and follows along with your comment of people might not read a few comments down and might miss your post).
3
villain
unfortunately i think feral really hit the nail on the head here :/ like i said, i am glad for the change but it has been handled poorly during the whole process (especially if you read & kept up w the forum posts like i did). they did change more than 2 words, but i really wish there had been a lot more transparency & idk grace/compassion involved. especially when you consider the main thing ppl were asking for was just to change the achievement name & nothing else. again, thank you for actually making these changes but i can very much understand the frustration
feral really hit the nail on the head here :/ like i said, i am glad for the change but it has been handled poorly during the whole process (especially if you read & kept up w the forum posts like i did). they did change more than 2 words, but i really wish there had been a lot more transparency & idk grace/compassion involved. especially when you consider the main thing ppl were asking for was just to change the achievement name & nothing else. again, thank you for actually making these changes but i can very much understand the frustration
5
Amber
@Valiska I already updated a lot of those items, if they are still showing as old in the shop it might be cache.
@feral It's not just two words that were changed.
@fun How would you suggest that change, then? I saw it as letting your discussion be undeleted because you pointed out the misinformation so just deleting that would ruin the context of your post. And detailing anything related to that would just keep people thinking the same thing they might already think about DID. The burden shouldn't be on you to have to repeat yourself multiple times, I was honestly trying to prevent that.
@feral It's not just two words that were changed.
@fun How would you suggest that change, then? I saw it as letting your discussion be undeleted because you pointed out the misinformation so just deleting that would ruin the context of your post. And detailing anything related to that would just keep people thinking the same thing they might already think about DID. The burden shouldn't be on you to have to repeat yourself multiple times, I was honestly trying to prevent that.
3
feral
I am just... incredibly disappointed with staff and how they've handled all this.
It took over a year and a half to fix two words.
Literally the least amount of effort on a public apology; because this is absolutely not one.
And here we are in the comments with staff continuing to refuse to listen to users with DID to continue to allow harmful content.
What the hell is going on with Subeta??
It took over a year and a half to fix two words.
Literally the least amount of effort on a public apology; because this is absolutely not one.
And here we are in the comments with staff continuing to refuse to listen to users with DID to continue to allow harmful content.
What the hell is going on with Subeta??
7
fun
the problem is is people are going to read 5 comments down, see misinformation that goes alongside an implication that i was being insensitive, not go to the forum (where this convo would be MORE out of context), and draw their own harmful and incorrect opinions. i explained why the info was not only outdated semantics but why it was HARMFUL and yet those comments stay up. why do people with DID have to jump through hoops on here to get people to understand and accept that certain things are bad and do effect us .
6
Amber
@hime And they have! The conversation that has already happened here in the comments will stay, which fun has pointed out the misinformation. The link wasn't added to the post until later (you can actually see where I comment about adding it).
Explaining why the change to the quests happened is important, that's not what I'm saying is off topic. What I'm saying is going into a debate between two different mental health issues because that's not what this change is about.fun has corrected that misinformation regarding that, too. There's no need to continue to drag out an already off-topic conversation out. I was hoping with the first correction from fun things would move on but they didn't (you can never really predict how comments will go).
fun has pointed out the misinformation. The link wasn't added to the post until later (you can actually see where I comment about adding it). Explaining why the change to the quests happened is important, that's not what I'm saying is off topic. What I'm saying is going into a debate between two different mental health issues because that's not what this change is about.
fun has corrected that misinformation regarding that, too. There's no need to continue to drag out an already off-topic conversation out. I was hoping with the first correction from fun things would move on but they didn't (you can never really predict how comments will go).
1
hime
Amber I appreciate your very diplomatic response but I think there is concern whether or not people will actually access the conversation that was already had on that thread. You can see from the comments below that many people are choosing not to read that thread and commenting here confused about why this change was made even though you were thoughtful enough to link it on the post. I think fun just wants to have their voice actually heard as part of a conversation that was already taking place in these comments and I think that that is valid.
I can understand why fun would want to clarify when they were borderline accused of being insensitive to others with schizophrenia or other disorders.
I can understand why fun would want to clarify when they were borderline accused of being insensitive to others with schizophrenia or other disorders.
11
Amber
@fun As I said in my post, it was going off topic debating what fits under one disorder from another. This post is about the quest being changed with, like you even suggested, the forum thread as to why it was harmful and needed to be changed. You've explained beautifully in your comments here already correcting misinformation and it's exactly why any past comments won't be deleted! It's the continuation of debating the topic (or rehashing the same thing in new words). I'm all for you sticking up for your community and I appreciate what you've said here! I have no plans on closing that forum topic, you are more than welcome to continue posting on there to explain why this was important to you to have changed.
5
fun
it IS relevant there ARE people asking about it and im one vocal person in a random comments section willing to help and educate people. there are so many users that deserve to have someone fighting for them but if we can't correct misleading information and allow the misleading comments to be kept up what are we supposed to do?
10
villain
glad this change has finally been pushed. i was recently diagnosed w DID a few months ago & it's been a very....difficult time coming to terms w it & explaining to ppl i know about it bc of stereotypes like split personality being so prevalent. so it is nice to see that y'all are being sensitive to our issues, even if it did take a very long time.
8
Amber
At some point, @SunsineSiren, maybe! Tomorrow the Seasonal quest shop will be getting some new items. ;)
2
Amber
@Truffula @fun I think we've gotten a little off topic here. While I find the history of mental health fascinating, this isn't the place to debate what does and doesn't fit under a particular umbrella. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge, fun. I've linked the thread about why the quest needed to change in the news post and encourage everyone who is curious about the change to read through it to better understand.
fun. I've linked the thread about why the quest needed to change in the news post and encourage everyone who is curious about the change to read through it to better understand.
4
Ang
oh I love this change! didn't need to read the post to understand why but after reading over the comments & feedback I love it even more. thank you guys for continuously listening to feedback and updating the site accordingly!
1
Amber
@Archmage For their updated lore you can read the subetapedia article. The way we used before, with a lot of good/evil and 'cursed' was disrespectful and harmful.
0
Archmage
@Rat
..Oh, thanks! I always thought they were more like different entities cursed to share the same body. Tbh I prefer my old understanding more since I like curse/magic/possession themes, but yeah "duality" fits the dissociative disorder concept better.
...Guess I'll just make my own cursed 2 souls in 1 body OC then lol
..Oh, thanks! I always thought they were more like different entities cursed to share the same body. Tbh I prefer my old understanding more since I like curse/magic/possession themes, but yeah "duality" fits the dissociative disorder concept better.
...Guess I'll just make my own cursed 2 souls in 1 body OC then lol
8
fun
uhh to be more clear. DID was formerly known as MPD, MPD is very outdated.
DID is NOT schizophrenia and never has been.
they have some comorbid symptoms but NOT the same thing, ever.
DID is NOT schizophrenia and never has been.
they have some comorbid symptoms but NOT the same thing, ever.
16
Amber
@StarShadow Shinwa and Battle quests aren't on the same system as our main quests, so when we reset quests they aren't included in that. :)
1
StarShadow
I see that Shinwa and Battle quests were not reset but grateful that I had just finished my quests for the day before the reset. Thanks.
1
fun
i would have liked staff to include in the post why the name was changed so we can avoid answering this question 500 times and help to avoid people spreading harmful misinfo. thank you for the changes
9
fun
please dont spread misinfo that DID is formally known as schizophrenia what on earth, and multiple personality disorder is another outdated offensive term
14
Rat
@Archmage @Jasper
reposting what i said on the last news post where people were also asking:
Mori and Nori are being changed because of sensitivity concerns towards Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID)/Folks who are systems, as many of thier lore (and associated items) present an outdated view of it (such as the "split personality" achievement and the "two faced" sticker, which are both outdated and rude/offensive towards people with DID/systems
for more information you can look into the whole discussion discussion on these threads:
https://subeta.net/forums.php/read/925130
https://subeta.net/forums.php/read/925767/MoriNoriMono-Ri-suggestions
reposting what i said on the last news post where people were also asking:
Mori and Nori are being changed because of sensitivity concerns towards Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID)/Folks who are systems, as many of thier lore (and associated items) present an outdated view of it (such as the "split personality" achievement and the "two faced" sticker, which are both outdated and rude/offensive towards people with DID/systems
for more information you can look into the whole discussion discussion on these threads:
https://subeta.net/forums.php/read/925130
https://subeta.net/forums.php/read/925767/MoriNoriMono-Ri-suggestions
9
Spatial
Awesome! thank you!
(also i'm oddly pleased they're in the same alphabetical order in the quest side bar lol)
(also i'm oddly pleased they're in the same alphabetical order in the quest side bar lol)
4
Archmage
Just curious since I barely play the game recently so maybe I'm missing out on lore and stuff, but what's the reasoning behind the change? ("Cursed" does sound cooler imo, but duality also fits the theme.)
3
Jasper
I was JUST about to do those quests when I get "Cursed is not a valid quest" and saw the header. :weary: Shame I missed out on free reset of quests but what can you do? Is this to be more sensitive to people with D.I.D?
2
MidnightFox
Oooh, this seems like a monumental shift on the site
Glad I'm here to witness it ^^
So happy for this wonderful character(s).
Great job @Amber! <3
(I'm sure it'll take me/some of us a while to notice all the little things, but continuity is definitely appreciated.)
Glad I'm here to witness it ^^
So happy for this wonderful character(s).
Great job @Amber! <3
(I'm sure it'll take me/some of us a while to notice all the little things, but continuity is definitely appreciated.)
0
kudzu
Oh man I was thinking about this the other day and here we are! New lore looks great, I'm glad time was taken to make sure everything was adjusted!
2
Amber
Oh, yeah if you did the quest before Shinwa then unfortunately you'd be stuck no matter what @Lizardheart. If you still have an issue tomorrow let me know!
0
Lizardheart
Not a major thing but I was a fool this morning and did my cursed quests before Shinwa. Shinwa immediately asked me for a piece from them ofc. I saw the reset and thought I had a chance but Shinwa is asking for the same thing but the visit link is broken since it's changed. Doing a duality quest didn't give me the piece.
Just a one time problem I imagine since the quest was stuck since this morning. No worries if I just have to take an L lol.
Just a one time problem I imagine since the quest was stuck since this morning. No worries if I just have to take an L lol.
0
Rat
Thank you so much for finally finishing this change! The subetapedia article is great imo, i like how Mono Ri gets her own character too, and its nice to hear about her adventure in rebuilding the statue. That would be a cool theme for an event in the future!
i also didnt get through very many quests before the reset, darn! its always fun getting to double quest
i also didnt get through very many quests before the reset, darn! its always fun getting to double quest
7
Amber
I'm just sorry it took so long, @Theatre! Like I put on the thread where users made some great suggestions, we're all spread pretty thin. Lore stuff has to be run by creative department, it took me a dumb amount of time to find every mention of quests around the site to make sure things pointed to the right place or tracked correctly. It was more than just updating a few item descriptions for sure! It was important to me to get everything updated at once instead of piece by piece, mostly because I wanted this to be as respectful as possible!
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